[super sorcerer]

I dont mean to change the combat statistics of the Aristocrat but otherwise give him new social abilities.

This is the list of the new class abilities of the Aristocrat:

*Good Manners - The Aristocrat add +1 to all diplomacy checks, double this bonus in his home kingdom and when he try to affect peaple from his home kingdom. The bonus grow by 1 every 2 levels (so it is +2 on level 3 , +3 on level 5 and so on).

*Know The Peaple - Starting on 2nd level the aristocrat add +1 to sense motive checks. This bonus grows by 1 every 4 levels (so it is +2 on level 6 , +3 on level 10 and so on). The bonus is doubled in his kingdom and when he try to affect peaple from his home kingdom.

*Born to be a leader - On level 4 the Aristocrat gain the leadership feat. The aristocrat also gain +2 bonus to his leadership score so a 7th level Aristocrat with a charisma score of 16 will have a leadership score of 12. The maximum cohort level for an aristocrat is his level-1 instead of his level-2

*A wise ruler - On level 8 the Aristocrat may add his wisdom bonus to his leadership score for followers. This ability does't effect cohorts.

*Loyal followers - On level 12 the followers and the cohotr (from the leadership feat) may add the Aristocrat's charisma modifier to their will saves.

*greater leadership - On level 16 the Aristocrat may add an extra +1 to his leadership score. furthermore the Aristocrat may have a second cohort, the second cohort's level is one lower than the usual. the second cohort maximum level is the Aristocrat level - 3.

*Exelent Comander of Loyal Guard - On level 20 or higher The followers (from the leadership feat) of the aristocrat may add the aristocrat's charisma modifier to their attacks and AC as long as the Aristocrat is no more than 100 feet away from them (or at least they think that the aristocrat is no more than 100 feet away).



What do you think of the new aristocrat?

[blacxthornE]

It's not bad. Of course, this class is completely useless in most combat encounters, but I guess a stereotypical aristocrat would be so. However, you could add (or replace) some class abilities to be more useful in combat: While an aristocrat is almost non-combatant, he could still have passive abilities like giving bonuses to his allies, make use of his intellect and perception in, again, give-allies-some-bonus-y ways. I also recommend renaming these abilities respectively to:

Diplomatic
Perceptive
Leadership Training
Wise Ruler (not "a" wise ruler)
Loyal Followers
Greater Leadership
Excellent Commander

Which just sound cooler to me. This is not an important part of the design of course, just a face-lift idea.

[Axel]

Not necessarily. Base aristocrat was a fair hand in combat. He had a good spread of weapon and armor proficiencies, 3/4 base attack, and d8 hit die; if I recall. He wouldn't shine in combat, but he could hold his own.

[RedSlayer]

have you looked at the Noble from, I believe, Dragon-lance? It might give you some inspiration.

[blacxthornE]

@Axel:
Well that's even better then. Because the class in the original post seems to be just good at ordering people around. I think he should have some some abilities that would help him in combat encounters too, not just between them.

[Raven Bloodmoon]

Overall, I like it. It's a little better flavored than the basic NPC class. Whie it might suck in general combat, I don't think an aristocrat really is intended to be in direct combat, unless he's stabbing the emperor repeatedly along with a few other aristocrat conspirators. I'd be interested in seeing a full wroteup sometime.

[Axel]

We should probably take a look at the NPC class before continuing: http://www.dandwiki..../SRD:Aristocrat
As NPC classes go this guy's not bad. Probably could take out some of the PC classes in a straight fight and average skill progression. He really does just need some class abilities to balance him. Good call there. Any other NPC classes we'd like to make playable?

[super sorcerer]

First of all I would like to thank all of you for helping me with that class.

Furthermore one main thing that peaple said here was the combat disadvantage of the character. While the aristocrat himself is probably less power at combat his cohort is better at combat than other cohorts of characters with the leadership feat becouse the cohort is usualy one level higher and I think it doe's make them more powerfull at combat as a pair to make up a little bit for the lower combat statistics.

I would also like to say that in most campaigns social power is also important and not just combat power. I must say that bards too have more social power than most other characters but less combat power than most other characters, yet there are many players who like to play bards anyway.

[blacxthornE]

I was just saying that even the bards had powers that offered actual combat bonuses to allies or disadvantages to enemies. That is why people play bards, they can participate in a way that helps the combat. Social powers do matter, but unless you have mechanics for it, it's all arbitrary. The best thing a social person could do in combat is to hinder it, which would be uncool for the fighters. As Axel pointed out, it may be a good enough fighter though, my comments were based on just these abilities. The only reason I suggested this was because even when cohorts do stuff for you, you don't feel special while your actual character sits back and watch. He could instead give bonuses, advantages/disadvantages, have aura thingies, inspire, taunt, etc. The cohort thing is a little messy around the book-keeping, so I think I disregarded the possibility of having them altogether, because I personally don't like them. But all this isn't really criticism; it's just pointing out in case you've overlooked something, but since you haven't then this is ready to go.